THE CORE

Fruits & Votes is the Web-log of Matthew S. Shugart ("MSS"), Professor of Political Science, University of California, Davis.

Perspectives on electoral systems, constitutional design, and policy around the world, based primarily on my research interests.

Also experiences with growing many varieties of fruit (always organic) and other personal interests. Please see the Mission Statement for more. (There is also an explanation of the banner.)

Other "planters" have been invited to contribute. Please check the "Planted by" line to see the author of the post you are reading.

Join the conversation. Comments are always open. Except, that is, when Word Press mysteriously shuts them down, which happens with distressing frequency.

Core principles:

Henry Droop on the "moderate non-partisan section"

Madison on "dangers from abroad" and "the fetters... on liberty"

The Head Orchardist's other sites:

PRESERVED FRUIT
orchard blocks
  • All
  • FRUITS
  • VOTES
  • wide open spaces
  • 24 September 2005

    Over at La Profesora Abstraída, Michelle Dion and I have been having a discussion about the separation of powers in Mexico under President Fox.

    As Michelle notes in her opening paragraph, leaders of business, labor, and the political parties whom she recently interviewed:

    stressed that policy is now made in the Congress, and that’s why the composition of party lists and getting representation of their interests in Congress is becoming even more important. [my emphasis]

    (Side note: President Fox’s party, the PAN, lacks a majority in either house, and the former hegemonic party, the PRI, is the largest party in each house. No party has a majority.)

    Michelle further observes:

    Congress in Mexico will continue to have a hard time demonstrating its independence from the Executive as long as the Congress lacks the resources and staff to research or develop policy positions.

    This raises the question of what it means to speak of the legislative branch in a presidential system as “independent.” For many decades in Mexico, the congress was totally subordinate to the presidency through the hegemonic PRI. Therefore, congress was not at all independent, notwithstanding the formal separation of powers. (Mexico’s constitutional structure is as close to that of the USA of any country in the world.)

    Now, with no majority for the president’s party (or any other), the congress is unmistakably independent in the sense that it debates (substantively, not merely pro forma), demands concessions, puts on amendments, and sometimes rejects outright bills presented by the executive. It also initiates bills not favored by the executive, which the president may sign into law or veto. Data collected by several of the presenters at a conference on the evolution of presidentialism and federalism in Mexico last March (co-organized by Jeff Weldon and me) demonstrate that congress, rather than the executive, is now the source of most major legislation. If that is not independence, then I do not know what that word means.

    But Michelle seems to have another dimension of independence in mind, and it is an important one to consider when looking at policymaking, and not just lawmaking, in presidential democracies. If I understand her correctly, she is concerned with the ability of the congress to have independent sources of technical information and expertise about policy proposals. The second quote from her original post, above, refers to the relative lack of staffing for congress, and she subsequently adds:

    Most members of the Chamber of Deputies and Senate have small staffs, usually one receptionist and a personal secretary.

    This is absolutely true, but drawing from that fact the implication that congress is therefore not independent is to commit the following fallacy. It assumes that the standard for judging legislative independence must be resemblance to the way the US Congress is organized: large individual staffs and lots of technical policy expertise (mostly matched with constituency interests).

    But why is the US Congress organized that way? Because individual members largely run their own independent electoral coalitions and have appropriated themselves staff to provide them with the independent information they need for that purpose.

    Michelle goes on to note that there is staff for congressional committees in Mexico, a small research service for the congress as a whole, and independent external contracting. Thus while there is not anything like the staffing available to individual members, there are other sources of information independent of the executive branch.

    Nonetheless, clearly Michelle is correct when she argues further that even these congress-wide sources of information are little match for the executive branch. Surely they still pale in comparison to the overall level of information resources available to congress as a whole in the USA.

    So this leads to a very important question: What kind of information do legislators need? If they need information to conduct independent re-election campaigns, as in the US, they need independent and individual information, as well as large committee staff, and congress-wide resources that place their institution on par with the executive branch in terms of technical specialization.

    But what do Mexican legislators need? They are ineligible for reelection. They thus have no need to develop independent re-election campaigns. We are only beginning to get a handle on what post-congressional careers will look like in the post-hegemonic era, but as long as the jobs most of them seek (whether other elective offices or appointive positions) continue to be controlled by party leaders (national or state), there is bound to be little incentive for these legislators to collect any information besides what is provided by those very same party leaders.

    In other words, we would be looking in the wrong place if we were looking to see what technical policy information Mexican legislators collect. Of what value is technical information if they are not going to run for office based on their individual reputation for having participated in crafting and improving the technical quality of policy?

    So, as Michelle notes in her comment to my comment:

    …the Congress vetos legislation and formulates new initiatives, but often the vetos are justified on ideological rather than technical or policy grounds…

    Exactly. Members of congress are following party cues, and if the party is positioning itself for the next election, then the only specialized information they need is whether this or that policy is consistent with the party’s positioning, not whether it is good techincal policy.

    Information on the impact of a presidential initiative on the party’s positioning for the next election comes from the party, not from anyone hired by congress or its members. In Mexico, it is still the parties that hire the legislators, and that has profound implications for the type of information that legislators (or the legislative branch as an institution) needs and appropriates for itself.

    So, is the Mexican congress independent of the executive? Sure. It is a forum for bargaining between very highly disciplined national parties, each of which has its distinct partisan political interests that it seeks to advance through the lawmaking process.

    Propagation: Seeds & scions (1)


    La Profesora Abstraida grafted Independence of the Mexican Congress, redux

    1 idea sprouting »

    1. Independence of the Mexican Congress, redux

      ….Based upon these observations, I still hypothesize that degree of legislative independence will vary across policy or issue areas, and that legislative independence will be weaker in highly technical or data intensive policy areas within the same i…

      Scion grafted by La Profesora Abstraida — 26 September 2005 @ 10:50

    RSS feed for comments on this post.

    TrackBacks

    To graft a scion to this planting, please use the following URL:
    http://fruitsandvotes.com/blog/wp-trackback.php?p=125
    (Non-MT bloggers click here to send pings.)

    Grafted scions that are not compatible with this planting's stock will die or be pruned out by the Orchardist.

    About the comment form

    Please note that the name you enter below and the first several words of your comment will appear on the right sidebar of the blog's front page, under "Propagation." New propagators might want to look at the comment policy.

    Please do not enter long URLs into the seedbed. Either mark them up using html hyperlinks or convert them to a "tiny URL." Thank you!

    Seedbed

    The soil is ready for planting:

    `

    FRUIT FEEDS
    PROPAGATION
    Recent comments.

  • Is MMP in Ireland’s future? (17)
    • JD: How about the following MMP variant: both constituency and party-list votes are ranked. The constituency contest happens under AV. The...
    • Tom Round: (MSS @9) “To be clear, no specific legal threshold, or any threshold at all, is a defining feature of MMP” True. However,...
    • Mark Roth: @ JD, I stand corrected. @Derek, I believe that someone proposed something similarish for Canada right after the last federal election....
    • Derek: I’ve always thought of a different type of MMP system. The % for the winning party determines the number of seats chosen proportiona...
    • Suaprazzodi: Will Ireland embrace a one vote or two vote MMP system? Will it use FPTP in conjunction with a closed party list corrective element...
    • JD: Mark: If I’m not mistaken, neither Bolivia nor Lesotho (both MMP users) have thresholds.
    • Ed: I had a somewhat similar intellectual journey to Tom Round, in that MMP was beguiling at first until you got into the details. For me the deal...
    • Mark Roth: Just to be argumentative,a nd with no offense meant: 1) As far as I know, every system that uses MMP does have some sort of threshold in...
    • MSS: To be clear, no specific legal threshold, or any threshold at all, is a defining feature of MMP. Technically, neither are single-seat...
    • Tom Round: I’m not unfamiliar with the attraction of MMP. I felt it myself when I first started studying electoral systems. It retains...
  • Pakistan general election 2013 (2)
    • MSS: The bandwagoning is taking place now. “PML-N gets majority after 18 Independents join party” (20 May). “43 newly elected...
  • Do UK elections now allow fusion candidacies? (13)
    • Derek: I’d like to see the idea of equal preferences in a country like UK.
    • Tom Round: Chris @9: “but in not having an UKIP opponent to siphon votes from the right.” Good point. However, given voluntary voting...
    • MSS: UKIP did admit during the recent local election campaign that it did not fully vet its candidates, due to (it was claimed) resource...
  • CROSS-POLLINATION

    FRUITS

    morn_blms_corralito.jpg

    The Fruit Blog (Fruit & fruit breeding)
    Daley's Fruit Tree Blog
    Orchards Forever
    The Orchard Keeper
    The Ethicurean
    The Jew and the Carrot
    Small farms ("real people & real food")
    Life begins at 30 (Farmers markets, etc.)
    Banana
    Festival of Trees
    Rare Fruit News Online
    Cloudforest Cafe


    VOTES

    bulgaria_protest copy

    Comparative democracy

    Psephos (Adam Carr's data archive)
    Electoral Panorama
    World Elections
    African Elections Database
    M. Herrera's Electoral Calendar
    Electoral Geography (Data archive)
    Michael Gallagher's data archive
    Election Finance (Blog, data archive)
    IFES
    Election Law (Rick Hasen)
    VoteLaw (Edward Still)
    Ballot Access News

    Electoral and Political Reform

    The FairVote Blog (US)
    Make my vote count (UK)
    Wilf Day (Canada)
    democraticSPACE (Canada)
    Citizens Assembly Blog (dormant)


    POLITOLOGY

    Blogs of political analysis

    PoliBlog
    Arms and Influence (dormant)
    Outside the Beltway
    Political Science Weblog (abstracts)
    Ideological Cartography (Adam Bonica)
    Frontloading HQ (Josh Putnam)
    FiveThirtyEight
    Vote View (Keith Poole)
    The Monkey Cage
    A Plain Blog About Politics (Jonathan Bernstein)
    Political Arithmetik (dormant)
    Polls & Votes
    Pollster.com
    Polysigh
    Reflective Pundit
    Rustbelt Intellectual
    Simon Jackman
    The semi-presidential one
    Josep Colomer
    Chapel Hill Treehouse (dormant)
    Political Behavior (dormant)
    Dart-Throwing Chimp
    Countries at the Crossroads (Freedom House blog)
    Jacob T. Levy

    REGIONAL ANALYSIS

    Canada

    The Mace
    ThreeHundredEight
    Crawl Across the Ocean
    Idealistic Pragmatist

    Europe

    Centre for European Politics
    Dr Sean's Diary
    A Fistful of Euros
    Political Reform (Ireland)
    UK Polling Report
    British Politics & Policy (LSE)

    Latin America

    Bloggings by boz
    Two Weeks Notice

    S.W. Asia & E. Mediterranean & N. Africa

    Informed Comment Global Affairs
    Lisa Goldman
    Michael J. Totten
    Yaacov Lozowick
    Marc Lynch (@FP)
    Ahwa Talk

    Africa

    La Constitution en Afrique

    E. Asia

    Frozen Garlic (Taiwan elections)

    New Zealand

    Kiwiblog
    No Right Turn

    OTHER SOCIAL SCIENCE BLOGS

    Crooked Timber
    Statistical Modeling
    Social Science Statistics
    Cold Spring Shops
    Marginal Revolution
    Brad DeLong
    Greg Mankiw

    SUN & MOON

    CURRENT MOON

    NEWS

    ABC

    BBC

    CBC

    Democracy Now!

    Deutsche Welle

    El Tiempo

    Guardian

    Haaretz

    Hindustan Times

    The Independent

    Irish Times

    NZ Stuff

    RFE/RL

    ORGANIZATIONS

    About/disclaimer

    California Rare Fruit Growers

    Center for Voting and Democracy

    Californians for Electoral Reform

    Society for American Baseball Research

    Link TV

    SCION EXCHANGE

    HARVESTS
    ORCHARD SERVICES

    Powered by WordPress